Understanding & Overcoming Spiritual Abuse, Part II, Understanding & Overcoming Spiritual Abuse, Escaping & Healing from Abusive Churches, Part 2. And Dan said it was just so unnerving. The audio recording that the elders reference was aired on popular Chicago radio personality Mancow Muller's show.Muller, once a trusted friend and confidant of MacDonald and also a member of Harvest Bible Chapel, has used his platform recently to call the pastor out on his less-than-exemplary handling of his critics. I remember that too. But as, as these excerpts of James speaking as, as James did, to so many people knew that, that this was the way he really, really spoke and who he really was. But it happened to me in the meeting where I raised a couple things and James McDonald is like, I dont remember that. So I had a pretty good sense of what the meeting was gonna be from that point on. But to also say, this was this was my fault, too. We knew what we knew what we were going to do. It was the elders failure. And they are even beloved by God. Today the guys share their conversation with journalist, author, and speaker Julie Roys. it's time for the cult of personality of James MacDonald at Harvest chapter to close and the actual Bible to be opened . I remember as a young pastor first hearing about James at a 2002 Moody Pastors Conference and reading his well written book on hermeneutics with an apologetic leaning and being blessed from his book. Give a gift of $30 or more to The Roys Report this month, and you will receive a copy of "Escaping the Maze of Spiritual Abuse" by Dr. Lisa Oakley and Justin Humphreys. And there were a number in the room who were looking at I Timothy 5, thats for those who persistence sin rebuke them in the presence of all so that the rest may stand in fear. She declined. He further claims Harvests elders crafted false accusations against him as a pure act of vindictiveness to cover the churchs looting of his former broadcast ministry, Walk in the Word. And I looked at it, and I could not read the whole letter in one sitting. The whole crooked machine needs to be brought down. I have them up at my website if you want to see those. However, MacDonald texted me an invitation to appear with him in a public forum to answer for the many many lies Ive reportedly written about him. But again, you push that issue, you got those letters. If hes ok with lying it places doubt on the gospel. Shame on you for reading scripture! In our required Old and New Testament classes, we utilized the Oxford Annotated Bible. No One Knows. Thanks that is hilarious!! I pray for the man. And I have, you know, probably probably six weeks later, less than, probably four weeks later or something I I apologized for signing that. James MacDonald. The Roys Report seeks to foster thoughtful and respectful dialogue. . Would you consider making a tax-deductible donation to help our journalists continue to report the truth and restore the church? Your tax-deductible gift helps our journalists report the truth and hold Christian leaders and organizations accountable. Theres still one more thing I want to ask about. Thats thats a much harder relaunch. When Christian leaders continue to teach that abuse does not constitute biblical grounds for divorce they are wrong, Vernick wrote. And all of the elders should resign and repent for what they did. So so sorry for anyone who has had to face the James MacDonald storm. James McDonald recently did a video with Ron Duitsman, as you said, former chairman of the elder board, where he claims this was all part of a campaign by Dallas Jenkins, whos a former executive leadership team member at Harvest. Still. He was in the many meetings leading up to McDonalds termination. In a recent Instagram story, Visconti, pastor of Generation Church in Mesa, claimed abuse is not a biblical justification for divorce. And in an Instagram post on November 21 that received 5,621 likes Visconti wrote: A weak woman with a strong husband will become a strong woman. Think of the godly ones youve known and thank God for them. Rick, Donald actually had talked to me after the meeting and said, how much that meant to James. And so what Id like to do is just rewind a couple of years to fall 2018. On Thursday, the seventh, I got a text from one of the elders who said, Call me if you can before such and such a time. I believe the board was deceived by Satan. She was a late comer to those of us who had been exposing MacD for a long time. Tell Harvest Church board hows the fruit now? So if you cant say anything, I mean, again, hes dismissive of the actual letters. And I said, Listen, I get it. And this was a spiritual battle. Because Im not a quiet guy in meetings. This is not my judgment but that of his elders from HBC. Again, she was the the wife of Dave Corning who was an elder at Harvest for over 20 years, and telling her stories, and one of her stories was you know about pictures of her being put up on a on a wall as a target practice for James McDonald and her seeing this shot up with a pellet gun. So Rick was in the meeting, as were others, and they were defending saying the elders should not have the letters. (Proverbs 27:12). But to tell people they have to stay in a situation of violence, trauma and harm, or return to it, this is not a core tenet of Christianity. We dont know how much the top people at Harvest make. The devil is at work. Dan also was in numerous meetings with James McDonald prior to his firing. How does this relate to his view of women? All my legal fees got paid. And I checked my voicemail. MacDonald adds, Of the more than 4000 Change Partners once faithfully supporting our efforts monthly, there are now about 150the remnant from which we seek to rebuild. He then invites people to send him gifts. Its impossible to take evangelicals seriously. My husband really appreciates James McDonalds preaching against my better judgement I told him about the new messagesso we have the Advent message from his Home Church network cast to the TV I had planned to leave the room so I didnt have to watch it I have to tell you he sounds sincere (without wax) I find the whole situation so heart breaking and confusing. And if I would, you know, post some sort of statement. So he did that. Hes like the whole the whole thing was about resigning. Those are simply other examples of posts about controversial issues. I remember saying we got to pray. That this was all a plot by him that he was vengeful, towards James McDonald. For narcissists, attracting attention is the point. Julie, thank you for your excellent work in exposing that which is done in darkness, among the body of Christ. A strong woman with a weak husband will become a toxic woman. I mean his letter, not just talking about the abusive behavior of James, but the things he did with the money going on African safaris with the church money. Im sorry, before a so called board.removes a man of God they must first consider the fruit of his ministry. I was thrown out of the church we gave our lives to by a group of rogue leaders, MacDonald writes. That didnt happen. If youre truly interested in hearing other views ask why or tell me how you landed there. Now, now James is saying, oh, Mancow edited this to say something that it really didnt say. Please dont read something into a story thats not there. And again, this was on the churchs dime. Five of the six have been published. Subscribe here for Pastor James' twice-weekly email devotionals straight to you inbox, plus occasional updates regarding his ministries, events, and personal news. She keeps demanding I tithe to her and she will ask god to bless me. While we were doing that, I was in my office at home. Well, maybe it had approval by the executive elders, maybe it had approval by Fred Adams, who was the CFO at the time. As I saw it, this letter of unconditional support was a huge and somewhat desperate PR move on James MacDonalds part, to say, hey, look, all our leaders stand with us, I must be okay. Julie Roys knows she published many false statements about me, false statements now proven such in a court of law, yet she has retracted nothing. Our marriage improved incredibly after we both agreed that neither one of us was Jesus. Both are true. John MacArthur, for example, has preached, Scripture does not automatically permit divorce in the case of a physically abusive husband. Instead, MacArthur urges abused wives not to provoke any circumstances that will make your husband become violent. But if he continues to be abusive, The wife should remove herself from danger by fleeing the home if necessary.. I had, of course, people from Harvest who had heard it, sending me sending me clips. I remember sitting on my couch waiting to press the button to publish it. Give a gift of $30 or more to The Roys Report this month, and you will receive a copy of Escaping the Maze of Spiritual Abuse by Dr. Lisa Oakley and Justin Humphreys. I stepped away from my computer a couple of times. But he said even the way said that he said, we got out of that meeting, we looked at each other. But according to a recent email by MacDonald, hes a victim of defamation by an envious childand needs your money to rebuild.. And I knew that I needed to do something publicly. So lets move on to these letters. Charles, I would listen to MacArthur, Piper and Macdonald on a regular basis. But James McDonald, he did not like to fly with the commoners, from what I understand. Not long ago, I noticed that James MacDonald is still latched onto evangelical watchdog blogger Julie Roys as his number-one. Now what we did do is there were probably I dont remember the number Julie. Give a gift of $30 or more to The Roys Report this month, and you will receive a copy of Escaping the Maze of Spiritual Abuse by Dr. Lisa Oakley and Justin Humphreys. And I, the next day, I wrote and said, Well, okay, I respect your wishes. Give a gift of $30 or more to The Roys Report this month, and you will receive a copy of Escaping the Maze of Spiritual Abuse by Dr. Lisa Oakley and Justin Humphreys. None of my sources said it was wrong. And while youre at it, Id really appreciate it if youd help us spread the word about the podcast by leaving a review. It wasnt an argument. In June, Visconti also posted a picture of him and his wife with James MacDonald and his wife. @jamesmacdonald. I said, again, please dont do it just because Im asking you. Guest Bios Show Transcript Many times, those who have experienced spiritual abuse are retraumatized when they try to speak about whats happened. So I appreciate it. James MacDonald (@jamesmacdonald) June 14, 2021. I felt physically sick reading the letter. Visconti also had posts supporting far-right causes. The multi-campus Harvest Bible Chapel in greater Chicago along with founder James MacDonald, has slapped several former workers and independent journalist Julie Roys with a defamation lawsuit alleging the publication of false information about the church, its finances and governance that resulted in the loss of 2,000 members. But somewhere around 2008-10 his preaching changed a bit. And I, I look back at those meetings that I was just describing, Julie, I dont I dont say this lightly. How do spot a safe pastorand can. The Asbury Revival Is Over. That this was all a plot by him that he was vengeful, towards James McDonald. So grateful to be healthy and happy in the Lord to where I can finally wade into the filth from JuLIE Roys. Only Gods opinion is what counts. Get new articles and breaking news delivered to your inbox. And then out of the blue, I get slapped with a lawsuit from James McDonald before I published anything. It is not an ecclesiastical remedy at least not any longer. But for us not to act would be unbelief. One is, I dont want people to give up on the church. Christian counselor and author, Leslie Vernick, took exception to Viscontis post. And he says he refuses to read it and says hes not going to mislead the congregation. When I did not immediately respond, MacDonald tweeted I had declined his invitation, which I did not. I think of a few things Julie. Thanks! Can you say what was in that letter? Toward that end, the site requires that people use their full name when commenting. Thanks for a thoughtful, educated, godly response. Okay thats what Gods word says. Her articles have appeared in numerous periodicals. And he conspired with these staff to bring these letters because they all just were out to get James. Yes, yeah, there were a number of people. And and Im still feeling it and Im still hearing from people. Were just talking a minute ago, you know, the emotion and the weight and the relief and the sadness, and all those things are true. How can a husband love his wife as Christ loved the church when he is emotionally, mentally, physically, and sexually abusive? The Roys Report seeks to foster thoughtful and respectful dialogue. Am I characterizing that correctly? Like so many other cradle to present churched people, all I ever knew was the KJV Bible. Honestly dont to this day. And again, youre one of the people who actually apologized for that. Do you expect ANYONE to say yes to your question. uterus or clean out a womb after a stillbirth (because these treatments are labeled abortions, and even that word brings out comments like yours). And if he doesnt, what does that mean in terms of employment at Harvest Bible Chapel? Julie Roys October 8, 2020. Sandy talked about over the years, other staff members coming to her after meeting with James McDonald in tears, just crushed. This was a many time thing. Ugh. And you know, told her that I would get it to the motherboard. I believe it was from Mancow who texted me. Good to be here. A Christian leader, according to 1 Timothy 3:3, should not be "greedy for filthy lucre.". Otherwise just say what you really mean in your question: Im better than you because I would never support pretty rotten.. Nah Gary, thats just typical cat behavior for you, with or without Kenneth Copeland. Well, and I remember, I remember this whole thing, because Im getting bits and pieces from different sources about whats going on and whats happening. Keep in touch with Julie and get updates in your inbox! Later that night, or first thing you know, into the wee hours of the next morning, the communication was out to the people of Harvest, and it was over. I hope you have a great day and God bless. Although as soon as, pretty much after Mancow aired it. That was you, wasnt it? So who is he talking about? And to give you the flavor of the meeting, when I walked in the room, and we all greeted each other, we were in the former executive pastors office around an oval table, and James McDonald sitting across from me. when men make the final decision in the marriage, even if they consult with their wife first, chances of divorce increases 7.4 times . Mine havent offered any blessings, but at least they havent eaten my extremities while I sleep. Patient, kind, not self-seeking. 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